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2012 Nexus 7 Discussion Forums (1st Generation) => Nexus 7 Android OS (Jelly Bean) => Topic started by: LenB on September 20, 2012, 07:47:23 AM

Title: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: LenB on September 20, 2012, 07:47:23 AM
Have been enjoying using my Nexus 7 and keep on learning something every day. I have not seen anything about backing-up all my Apps and Settings probably to my PC or maybe even to Google Drive. Is this advisable, or even possible?
I have read some information about 'Rooting' which sounds interesting but quite intimidating. (What is 'Rooting'!) Is there somewhere I can read up about this (in an easy to understand way). Would a 'Rooting' tutorial and/or discussion be a welcome addition to this forum. Looking forward to reading Forum members views on this.
Thank you Forum for making my enjoyment of the Nexus 7 even greater. The reviews of Apps and Accessories are very enjoyable. Thank you.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 20, 2012, 08:18:39 AM
Here you go LenB, the Forum's Guide to rooting the Nexus 7, which also contains a brief explanation of rooting and the advantages.

Nexus7Forun.com Guide to Rooting (http://nexus7forum.com/index.php?topic=367.0)
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 20, 2012, 01:51:41 PM
With the Root Toolkit by WugFresh in Primes thread you'll certainly find rooting less daunting and there is a whole plethoria of things that can be done with a rooted device but more importantly root can easily be undone and this device is very hard to brick.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: bjs229 on September 20, 2012, 03:27:26 PM
I was in the same boat about a week ago. With the help of Primes thread and JJ answering my million questions I am rooted, backed up and light years ahead of where I was. All of my fears of bricking my Nexus are gone.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 20, 2012, 05:44:22 PM
I will "thumbs up" bjs229 on the previous post. It will be the first of many.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: LenB on September 22, 2012, 07:34:00 AM
Thank you S.Prime for your reply which is very interesting and I will probably pluck up courage to try it later on. At the moment I think my Nexus 7 looks very good (I wondered if I should use the word 'pretty', but decided against it!) and I don't want to lose this and start again - yet anyway!
Do I understand properly that until I 'root' my Nexus 7 I am not able to make a 'backup'?
Thanks for your help and other members interest. It's appreciated.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: birdastrompgman on September 22, 2012, 10:11:35 AM
You can do data backups anytime, rooted or not.  You may have to be rooted to do Nandroid OS and data backups.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 22, 2012, 10:40:41 AM
You will need root to make a "Nandroid" backup, which backs up your OS (ROM) or to run Titanium Backup, which backs up your Apps and Data. I will have to say that Nexus 7 has a great stock ROM and very little bloatware, so IMO the choice to root rests on the users desire to unlock advanced features and/or tryout custom ROM's.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 23, 2012, 07:38:49 AM
Anyway of backing up the installed apps & data on an un-rooted Nexus 7 before rooting, but still being able to then restore said apps & data once rooted?

What backup apps are there for un-rooted devices please?
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: bjs229 on September 23, 2012, 09:47:32 AM
Avg antivirus pro backs up your apps. I think that Astro does too.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 23, 2012, 03:36:41 PM
Avg antivirus pro backs up your apps. I think that Astro does too.


Astro file explorer ??
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: bjs229 on September 23, 2012, 03:52:45 PM
My bad. I thought Astro file explorer did.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 23, 2012, 05:45:38 PM
From what I saw Astro will backup the install apk. Sorry just from my recollection.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 23, 2012, 06:20:32 PM
Yes Prime is correct, Astro backs up/copies the apk...obviously this does not back up the apps data...
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 24, 2012, 06:02:09 AM
So no backup tool for un-rooted tablets, even from Google ??

Not the end of the world, but would be nice to do a backup once per month for example.

So, looks like I need to discuss fully, rooting methodology as that seems the only way to back up your tablet, but it's a bit of a mine-field, even for me with 30+ years in an IT/Unix Support role.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 24, 2012, 06:44:40 AM
Okay I'm going to backtrack a little here...

Don't think of rooting a true hacking, it's not. You are simply replacing the su binary for custom su binary thus giving you administrative rights at the root level which is something we all have in Windows.

EDIT: CBers, what kind of backup are you wanting? You can back up an Android device, there are apps that allow the back up of apps, contacts that aren't synced and on Android phones you can back up SMS messages and Call logs etc but you cannot back up system data and app data because of the lack of root level adminastrative rights.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: LenB on September 24, 2012, 08:42:29 AM
Am quite relieved that CBers appears to be as apprehensive as I am about this 'rooting' business. However, other people are being successful with rooting, so it is probably not as fraught with problems as one would assume.
I note from the 'Settings' page that there is a section called 'Backup & reset'. For the average user, will this be all they will ever need to get back the information they may have lost?
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 24, 2012, 08:56:06 AM
I think everyone is apprehensive about their first attempt at rooting. I even practiced on a spare phone before I had the courage to attempt it on my personal device, but after experiencing my first rooted Android device, I have never looked back and do not own any Android device that is not rooted. That said, I would estimate that only 5-7% of Android devices are rooted, so those of us who choose root are certainly in the minority.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 24, 2012, 10:26:30 AM
Okay I'm going to backtrack a little here...

Don't think of rooting a true hacking, it's not. You are simply replacing the su binary for custom su binary thus giving you administrative rights at the root level which is something we all have in Windows.

EDIT: CBers, what kind of backup are you wanting? You can back up an Android device, there are apps that allow the back up of apps, contacts that aren't synced and on Android phones you can back up SMS messages and Call logs etc but you cannot back up system data and app data because of the lack of root level adminastrative rights.


Just the ability to do a backup on a regular basis in case of a worst-case scenario where the tab;let is broke beyond recovery (rare I know), so that I can quickly restore the backup to a new device.

Might just try rooting my Nexus 7 when I have a chance, but it opens a new can of worms about which ROM to install, how to choose it, and how to know that it hasn't got viruses in etc.

Diving into the XDA forums is quite formidable, as there are so many users, threads and ROMs mentioned.

In the "Step by Step Guide to Rooting The Nexus 7 Tablet (http://nexus7forum.com/index.php?topic=367.0)", there is mention of CWM - what is this ?? And also TWRP again, what is this, but it doesn't seem to have been updated for a few months - has development on this stopped ??

If I do decide to root my nexus, how will I get Android OS updates, or do I have to wait for a ROM to be updated by (non-official) developers ??

There seems to be so many BETA versions of ROMs and apps that you need to run alongside them, it seems very flakey to the average user.

Don't get me wrong, as I have used hacks on OS's in the past, so not adverse to doing it, but Android is still fairly new to me, and the OS's I have used have been intact from the manufacturer and then hacked to use, as opposed to installed a hacked OS as in Android.

Sorry for all of these questions, but hopefully it might help others.


Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 24, 2012, 11:00:48 AM
CBers, have a read of this (http://www.Nexus7Forum.com/index.php?topic=1009.0). It should answer most of your questions.
As for custom ROM's, custom ROM's in the Android world are built from source, this is known as cooking and the dev a chief. I've have never heard of a ROM with a virus but that's not to it's never happened or never will.
You don't have to flash a custom ROM if you've rooted, some just root for the ability to have adminastrative rights at root level and be able to backup with a custom recovery, hack, mod and tweak their device. It's your device so your choice.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 24, 2012, 11:09:38 AM
Thanks JayJ for that link - I think I must have read that 50 times myself.

Anyway, an update : I've rooted my Nexus 7  :P

It took 30 minutes, but I was double-reading each line and double-checking each step.

It was a breeze using WUGFRESH's toolkit.

It's all worked, so now I need to find out what's different and start re-installing all of my apps etc.

Two questions though.

1) Will I still be notified if there is an update to the current ROM installed ??
2) I used the "Custom Recovery" option when rooting (mainly due to S. Prime's edit of 04/08) - what has this opened/limted ??

 8)  :o  :P  :-*
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: birdastrompgman on September 24, 2012, 11:44:53 AM
LenB, Yes, the N7's Cloud backup should save your apps list along with passwords and cache settings.  Since it's integrated with Google Play, gmail, etc., all your Google data should be recoverable.  I doubt that your Amazon Kindle books will be backed up this way.  When you re-install the apps (manually), you'll get all your Google data back.  But you won't get your shortcuts back, and you'll have to setup your widgets all over again.

The dedicated backup apps try to save additional data, like phone address/contact lists, and they let you batch process backups and recovery.  Unfortunately, unless you're rooted, they probably can't (I've never used them) backup/recover shortcuts and widget setups, either.  Go to the Google Play store and search for backup to see what's available for unrooted users.

I rooted mine without problems.  The people who'll have problems, IMHO, are those who aren't familiar enough with computers to know how to find/load device drivers and/or understand computer terminology.
Title: Re: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 24, 2012, 12:16:15 PM
Thanks JayJ for that link - I think I must have read that 50 times myself.

Anyway, an update : I've rooted my Nexus 7  :P

It took 30 minutes, but I was double-reading each line and double-checking each step.

It was a breeze using WUGFRESH's toolkit.

It's all worked, so now I need to find out what's different and start re-installing all of my apps etc.

Two questions though.

1) Will I still be notified if there is an update to the current ROM installed ??
2) I used the "Custom Recovery" option when rooting (mainly due to S. Prime's edit of 04/08) - what has this opened/limted ??

 8)  :o  :P  :-*

Glad it went well mate, didn't think it wouldn't mind you.

You won't see any physical changes, they're all at root levelbut if you install apps like Titanium which will allow you to backup your apps and their data and apps like Root Explorer, you can see root level or "/" level files.
Another app I love is Adfree, does what it says on the tin.

1. Yes you'll still get OS updates or Android iteration updates.

2. What recovery did you select? CWM (ClockworkMod) or TWRP (Team Win Recovery Project)?

I am unaware of any limitations custom recovery installation brings, it's more a case of what a custom recovery brings you which is the ability to backup the whole system and flash images and files.
A backup know as a nandroid backup copies the whole of your system files, you do a nandroid backup and then restore using that backup and your device will be identical to how it was when the backup was performed from email accounts to app data to widgets ogn your homescreen...
A custom recovery also allows you to flash images such as the boot image through a zip file, such zips could also be complete ROM's, a kernel or system files to tweak the performance or look of your device.

Hope that helps.

LenB, Yes, the N7's Cloud backup should save your apps list along with passwords and cache settings.  Since it's integrated with Google Play, gmail, etc., all your Google data should be recoverable.  I doubt that your Amazon Kindle books will be backed up this way.  When you re-install the apps (manually), you'll get all your Google data back.  But you won't get your shortcuts back, and you'll have to setup your widgets all over again.

The dedicated backup apps try to save additional data, like phone address/contact lists, and they let you batch process backups and recovery.  Unfortunately, unless you're rooted, they probably can't (I've never used them) backup/recover shortcuts and widget setups, either.  Go to the Google Play store and search for backup to see what's available for unrooted users.

I rooted mine without problems.  The people who'll have problems, IMHO, are those who aren't familiar enough with computers to know how to find/load device drivers and/or understand computer terminology.

I agree with the part about Backup and restore in settings, this backs up your Google account, web passwords, Wi-Fi set ups including keyphrases etc. Google Backup & restore doesn't just remember you app list, if you Factory reset your device it will reinstall your app automatically for you.
It does backup apps installed from Google Play but obviously not their data. How are books store on a device, if it's cloud based then you'll only need to install the app and sync. If they're saved to the internal memory then they should also still be there unless wiped/cleared/deleted by the user. I use comiXology app on both my N7 and S2, if I flash a custom ROM or uninstall the app and reinstall my comics are still save on the in internal memory.

As for your comment about the people that are going to have trouble rooting are those without or with little PC experience, I disagree because that's me...
I have very limited PC knowledge compared to what I know about Android (which is less than I'd like to), I'm 38 yo and did a little basic work on PC's whilst at school in the 80's and earlier 90's, made some bad life choices and never owned my first PC until about 5 yes ago.
What I'm trying to say is my PC knowledge is very limited but I have successfully rooted three Android devices and learnt computer terminology along the way, I think the key thing here is research and that's what most of us so before jumping in.
Title: Re: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 24, 2012, 01:29:27 PM
Two questions though.

1) Will I still be notified if there is an update to the current ROM installed ??
2) I used the "Custom Recovery" option when rooting (mainly due to S. Prime's edit of 04/08) - what has this opened/limted ??

1. Yes you'll still get OS updates or Android iteration updates.

2. What recovery did you select? CWM (ClockworkMod) or TWRP (Team Win Recovery Project)?
[/quote]

1. OK, cool.
2. Not sure - when I selected flash, I ticked "And also flash: Customer Recovery" (see here (https://dl.dropbox.com/u/8367652/Rooting%20option.JPG))

What did I flash, the stock OS but unlocked ??

So do I need a Custom Recovery then, such as CWM (ClockworkMod) or TWRP (Team Win Recovery Project) ??

Installed GooManager (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.s0up.goomanager&feature=nav_result#?t=W251bGwsMSwxLDMsImNvbS5zMHVwLmdvb21hbmFnZXIiXQ..) to get TWRP, after watching the (23 minute) video and TWRP is now installed.

I used latest version of WUGFRESH's Toolkit, v1.5.3.

I am unaware of any limitations custom recovery installation brings, it's more a case of what a custom recovery brings you which is the ability to backup the whole system and flash images and files.
A backup know as a nandroid backup copies the whole of your system files, you do a nandroid backup and then restore using that backup and your device will be identical to how it was when the backup was performed from email accounts to app data to widgets ogn your homescreen...
A custom recovery also allows you to flash images such as the boot image through a zip file, such zips could also be complete ROM's, a kernel or system files to tweak the performance or look of your device.

Hope that helps.

OK, I have installed TITANIUM backup and performed a backup - is this the best ??

What about root keeper (https://play.google.com/store/search?q=root+keeper) - does it need to be on all the time, or only during an OTA update ??

By the way, I now have everything back as it was pre-root, so all in all, about 2 hours start to finish  8)
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 24, 2012, 02:41:14 PM
Simply install Rootkeeper and you will be prompted to protect your system when you open the program the first time and it creates a "SU"  backup and you are done. Then if you ever lose root due to an OTA update, you can restore root with OTA Rootkeeper. The app does not run continuous, so you do not have to be concerned with that.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 24, 2012, 02:42:53 PM
Thanks S.Prime.

Expect loads more questions post-rooting  :D

PS. Why do I not get notifications via email (or TapaTalk) about updates to this and other threads I've commented in.

I have INSTANT NOTIFICATION set on my profile, but nothing received today.

I can't see a SUBSCRIBE TO THIS THREAD on this page anywhere.

TIA.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: bjs229 on September 24, 2012, 03:10:26 PM
Glad to see you got it done CB!
I never installed Root keeper. What is the temp unroot button for?
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 24, 2012, 03:45:51 PM
Thanks bjs229.

Finally succumbed to the dark side.

All seems OK at the moment, but and seems a bit faster but that might just be the placebo effect.

I think temp unroot allows for OTA updates?
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 24, 2012, 04:29:26 PM
The temporary un-install option is designed to save the SU file. The OTA can be written to remove root if it is detected, but with the temporary un-install option, you hide root from the OTA. Generally this occurs in the mobile industry when the provider wants to block the usage of root, but with the tools that Google has provided for full system recovery and the easy access to rooting tools, I do not see this as a problem. I continue to use OTA RootKeeper more out of habit and paranoia than necessity at this point.
Title: Re: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: bjs229 on September 24, 2012, 07:30:59 PM
The temporary un-install option is designed to save the SU file. The OTA can be written to remove root if it is detected, but with the temporary un-install option, you hide root from the OTA. Generally this occurs in the mobile industry when the provider wants to block the usage of root, but with the tools that Google has provided for full system recovery and the easy access to rooting tools, I do not see this as a problem. I continue to use OTA RootKeeper more out of habit and paranoia than necessity at this point.
Thanks
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 25, 2012, 01:13:40 AM
A quick question, but but how do I get TWRP to run please?
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: S.Prime on September 25, 2012, 05:48:01 AM
Download GooManager from Google Play and select reboot recovery and you will find TWRP.
Title: Re: Re: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 25, 2012, 02:21:40 PM
What did I flash, the stock OS but unlocked ??

No the OS is still your original OS, the toolkit uses ADB commands via a Windows command prompt to unlock the device then the tool kit flashes modded "su" binary to your N7 to gain root privledges. Finally SuperSU and the Busybox applications are pushed to your N7.

OK, I have installed TITANIUM backup and performed a backup - is this the best ??

Yes Titanium is the best backup application available, I don't think there is anything available that does what TB does. Check out user reviews and it's download numbers on GP.
Titanium has so many features, just to touch on a few...

Uninstall system apps
Freeze system apps
Back up system and user apps and data(be warned most developers do not advise restore of system apps)
Clean dalvik cache (good when uninstalling system apps)
Extract from nandroid backups...

The list goes on.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 25, 2012, 02:38:49 PM
Thanks JayJ.

So, could I do an app back up with TITANIUM and then use TWRP to install a different ROM and then restore from the app backup to get me back to where I was ??

Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 25, 2012, 03:08:10 PM
Yes mate, that's exactly what I do all the time when flashing ROM's. Be aware that it's advised against by the likes of Codeworkz and other recognised developers (cheifs) to avoid backing up and restoring system apps, user apps are fine though.

If flashing a custom ROM for the first time...

1. Download ROM and Gapps (most ROM's don't have Gapps included so download seperatley), there are many ROM's available on XDA as you know but there's also Rootzwiki and there are some ROM's for the N7 available on Goo Manager under "Browse compatible ROMs".

2. Reboot to recovery via Goo Manager and perform a backup, it's up to you whether you include Recovery and Cache in the backup as they won't be checked on your first backup and it's also up to you whether you choose to compress the backup file. Before flashing a ROM I would personally recommend backing up your internal user memory (sdcard0), now after a backup is a good time because it will include the backup you've just done. Better safe than sorry so just reboot system and connect to PC to copy and paste the sdcard0 to your PC.

3. Once you've backed up your current ROM wipe the existing, so from Home in TWRP select "Wipe" and then "Factory reset", "Cache", "Dalvik Cache", "System" and "Format Data" one at a time to completely wipe your existing ROM from your N7.
Do NOT under any circumstances try booting after a full wipe

4. Flash your new ROM, from home select "Install" and the TWRP file explorer will appear. Find the ROM you downloaded and if you used Goo Manager it's under...

/sdcard/goomanager

Select the ROM zip and then if your flashing Gapps seperately select "Add More Zipps", again you'll be taken to the TWRP file explorer so select the Gapps you downloaded and swipe to confirm flash. Once flash is complete I always use the option to Wipe Dalvik Cache and Cache again to be sure but that's up to you, Reboot and your done.

Explorer and enjoy your new custom ROM.

Let us know how you get on.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 26, 2012, 01:52:30 AM
Thanks JayJ.

Any ROMs give us anything better than stock?
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 26, 2012, 07:37:55 AM
Paranoid Android is interesting, you can control the user space. You can have Phablet mode which the N7 is in already or Tablet UI without hacking the build.prop, you can also adjust the apps individually.
It's based on CM10 so any bugs are the same as CM10.

There's also CM10 obviously, Codename Android, BAMF and AOKP. These are all available through Goo Manager or you could try Slim Bean available through XDA, I was running Slim ICS on my S2 but I'm running Slim Bean on it.
I'd suggest trying a few out see what you like, they all similar because they're based on AOSP but all have differing tweaks and mods.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 26, 2012, 09:20:24 AM
OK, thanks.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: CBers on September 28, 2012, 04:17:04 AM
2. Reboot to recovery via Goo Manager and perform a backup, it's up to you whether you include Recovery and Cache in the backup as they won't be checked on your first backup and it's also up to you whether you choose to compress the backup file. Before flashing a ROM I would personally recommend backing up your internal user memory (sdcard0), now after a backup is a good time because it will include the backup you've just done. Better safe than sorry so just reboot system and connect to PC to copy and paste the sdcard0 to your PC.

So is it just the TWRP\BACKUPS folder I need to backup to my PC for safe keeping, or all of sdcard0 ??
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 28, 2012, 06:02:52 AM
Well it depends, if you have anything of importance on your N7 then I'd suggest backing up the whole of your sdcard0. Otherwise just backup the TWRP folder mate.
Title: Re: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: bjs229 on September 28, 2012, 09:43:21 AM
Yes mate, that's exactly what I do all the time when flashing ROM's. Be aware that it's advised against by the likes of Codeworkz and other recognised developers (cheifs) to avoid backing up and restoring system apps, user apps are fine though.
What does this mean exactly? Avoid backing up and restoring system apps? I was going to try playing with some roms but now I am totally confused. When I backup my device with titanium I assume it is backing up everything so if I ever had an issue I could go back to exactly where I am or was.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 28, 2012, 11:09:00 AM
Think your getting confused mate....

TWRP backs up your system, if you have a problem with a ROM or you change something that causes a problem you can just restore the backup after a full wipe within TWRP.

Titanium Backup backs up applications and their data, primarily I use Titanium to back up my user apps and their data for when I either flash a custom ROM or restore a back up that doesn't have newer apps on. I have Titanium set to do automatic backups at set intervals.

Codeworkz (CyanogenMod developer) along with other developers don't recommend using Titanium to restore system apps because restoration of a system app in the custom ROM's they develop can cause problems and thus people bug report and they spend time trying to resolve this problem which wastes their time developing the ROM.
You can if you want but if you post on XDA and seek help you will probably be told that support is not given when system apos are restored.
There's little point backing up system apps anyway as there is nothing of any major importance that can't be replaced anyway.

Hope that helps.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: bjs229 on September 28, 2012, 08:45:49 PM
Me confused? Absolutely! I understand now. I think. Custom roms don't try and restore system apps.
Title: Re: Backup and Rooting.
Post by: JayJ on September 28, 2012, 11:58:29 PM
It's not recommended, put it that way...